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为什么Arc'Teryx只用GoreTex?

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发表于 2009-10-13 01:57 | 显示全部楼层 |阅读模式
无意中看到的,一个ArcTeryx加拿大员工答网友的提问:
简单的说应为GoreTex防水透气性很均衡,而且耐用性好,A是不用Performance Shell材料的,因为没有什么突出的优点。
另外就是A和G公司的关系很好,好到一起爬山……

还有些A公司的工厂图:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mkwilliams/sets/72157622070413952/show/


Doog
on Jun 15th, 2009
@ 6:22 PM:  

Michael
It was really cool to meet you here at Arc’teryx a few weeks ago! Michael got to know one of our Managers here through a friend-of-a-friend, and we ended up inviting him out to see what we are all about.

As an Arc’employee, I thought I’d chime in and answer a couple of questions that have come up here.

GORE-TEX: why do we use it?
We’ve done a huge amount of testing, and yes, it does breath! I’ll admit it doesn’t breath as much as some other fabrics, but then those fabrics wouldn’t be waterproof. That’s why we were a big part of bringing in the Softshell revolution 10 years ago, (we helped develop Power Shield with Polartec). As for GORE-TEX—it and a banner bluebird day don’t really mix. However, if the weather is Scottish, GORE-TEX does what it says – it keeps you dry, is windproof, and it does breath enough to keep the transport of moisture happening, so you stay comfortable.
Also, keep in mind that different GORE-TEX systems breath at different levels. GORE-TEX Pro Shell is the best, but also the costliest (isn’t that always the way?), and GORE-TEX Performance Shell is down the scale in cost and not as good in overall performance (BTW – we don’t use Performance Shell. Not that it isn’t good – just not good enough for us! Yes, we are gear snobs…).

How does GORE-TEX compare to other windproof, breathable, waterproof fabrics?
GORE-TEX Pro Shell is at the top of the heap in initial performance (it works really well right out of the box), as do two other fabric systems. But after 200 hard days of use with 20 washings in between, GORE-TEX Pro Shell is the only one that still performs very closely to it’s first day performance. None of the other fabric systems have this level of durability. And that’s the reason we keep using it: it’s durability is far above the competition. By a long shot.

That sort of answers the next question: no law suits are going down between us and Gore. Fact is, it is about as healthy a professional relationship as exists. Our VP of R&D just got back from Alaska, trying to climb some new alpine routes, with our GORE-TEX sales rep. And this was their second time. So we are pretty close. We do share a load of our R&D with Gore, which goes a long way in helping them develop new fabrics and systems.
We have explored and tested a number of different waterproof systems, and continue testing them. When we find one that performs and lasts as long as we think it should, we’ll use it. And yes, we’ll let Gore know, too…

Michael – thanks for coming to see what we are all about. It’s a fun company to work with, and as you saw we’re a little nuts about making really good shit.
I hope this doesn’t come across as too commercial – I am biased, but all this stuff is true…

无论从图还是Doog的另一个回复,都可以看出加产A其实是Made by Chinese in Canada :D

Doog
on Jul 16th, 2009
@ 10:20 AM:  
Just a quick comment to Tien on Arc’teryx’s predominantly Asian employee base: Welcome to Vancouver, melting pot of the Pacific. In Vancouver, English is now NOT the first language of more than 50% of the population. Chinese, Indians, Iranians, Koreans, Philipino, Vietnamese… and somewhere in there are a few white guys!
发表于 2009-10-13 02:30 | 显示全部楼层
打了多少原产地教条主义者的脸啊
发表于 2009-10-13 08:34 | 显示全部楼层
淮南淮北
发表于 2009-10-13 08:40 | 显示全部楼层
“I hope this doesn’t come across as too commercial ”———But it DOES.
兼听则明,再写封信问问eVent和Toray对此的反应会很有趣。
发表于 2009-10-13 17:22 | 显示全部楼层
有点像wintel的翻版
发表于 2009-10-14 09:53 | 显示全部楼层
原帖由 <i>mc鲁迅</i> 于 2009-10-13 02:30 发表<br />
打了多少原产地教条主义者的脸啊
<br />

呵呵~~鸟圈的原教旨主义~~
 楼主| 发表于 2009-10-14 11:09 | 显示全部楼层
红毛鬼多半比较崇尚发达国家生产,还美其名曰:因为发达国家对人权和环境的保护比发展中国家好。
到别处去拉完屎还指着自己的粪说这地方太脏了

原帖由 <i>fatboycsc</i> 于 2009-10-14 09:53 发表<br />
&lt;br /&gt;<br />
<br />
呵呵~~鸟圈的原教旨主义~~
<br />
发表于 2009-10-16 11:39 | 显示全部楼层
A是不用Performance Shell材料的,因为没有什么突出的优点。

确实如此
发表于 2009-10-17 10:06 | 显示全部楼层
实际使用中,至少周围几位感觉eVENT的透气效果很好。

为什么eVENT的市场做得不好?因为GE根本没把户外面料市场当一回事,毕竟这市场太小。甚至连GE的员工有的也只知道GTX,而不知道eVENT。
发表于 2009-10-17 11:18 | 显示全部楼层
原帖由 <i>zhujie1225</i> 于 2009-10-17 10:06 发表<br />
实际使用中,至少周围几位感觉eVENT的透气效果很好。<br />
<br />
为什么eVENT的市场做得不好?因为GE根本没把户外面料市场当一回事,毕竟这市场太小。甚至连GE的员工有的也只知道GTX,而不知道eVENT。
<br />
因为GE根本没把户外面料市场当一回事

就冲这点,我就不选event了:你都不把我们当回事,凭什么要我们把你当回事
发表于 2009-10-17 11:41 | 显示全部楼层
通用电器的产品线比戈尔广得多,这个做滤膜的似乎也是后来才收购下来的,不把户外面料方面当回事也好理解啦
发表于 2009-10-17 12:35 | 显示全部楼层
  面料永远都只是面料,无论谁的面料,也不论它是不是真的比戈尔的好。至少在服装上目前还是没有能超越GTX服装的,请注意前面这段话我说的是两种东西,一种是面料一种是服装。
  鸟一向自诩用世界上最好的材料和最好的工艺来做产品,从目前它的产品上来讲也确实无出其右。而它一直选择戈尔的产品,一定有它的道理。
  EVENT是否一定比GTX好我不知道,简单的把它不把面料市场当回事一定是错的,前年我还与其公司的高层谈过,绝对不是不重视。
  从产品上来讲,我在世界上只看到GTX可以从面料控制到胶条到工艺要求到生产机器到生产流程,其它没有一家可以做到的。就是太黑价格贵。
发表于 2009-10-17 12:45 | 显示全部楼层
宣传是口号,别当真,甭管他们一直在“号称”什么。

生意是生意,产品质量是产品质量,两者没有绝对的直接因果关系,通用从杰克韦尔奇开始就坚持“数一数二”原则,没有达到相当程度市场占有率的项目一律砍掉卖掉或者不予以充分重视支持,当年杜邦做化纤那么NB,预计到行业盈利将走下坡路就立即砍掉,这些和产品质量好坏没直接关系。
公司的目标是赚钱盈利,而不是做出高质量产品,后者只是为了达到前者的手段之一而已,甚至不是重要手段,探路者上市了,那么多产品质量比他强的牌子就上不了市。
发表于 2009-10-17 12:48 | 显示全部楼层
原帖由 <i>砾岩</i> 于 2009-10-17 12:45 发表<br />
宣传是口号,别当真,甭管他们一直在“号称”什么。<br />
<br />
生意是生意,产品质量是产品质量,两者没有绝对的直接因果关系,通用从杰克韦尔奇开始就坚持“数一数二”原则,没有达到相当程度市场占有率的项目一律砍掉 ...
<br />
 一、你是否会披着面料出去?如果不是,就不能只能面料,要谈服装
 二、世界上有谁可以象戈尔这样控制到全部的生产制造各环节?
  如果没有,呵呵,就验证我的观点。
发表于 2009-10-17 13:05 | 显示全部楼层
我说的不是戈尔和EVENT,是说从市场占有率看产品质量。

两者也许一个注意生产塑料,一个即注意塑料也注意布料和别的方面。至于所谓的综合性能到底如何,得用综合的实验数据和综合的实践反馈来说明,按医药测试标准的话都得足够数量的同工况双盲实验对比才有真正说服力。
所以我认为单纯说XXX好或者XXX不好,更多是个人主观经验感受或是样本数量不够充足的个案情况。
发表于 2009-10-17 13:18 | 显示全部楼层
原帖由 <i>鸡肚皮</i> 于 2009-10-17 11:18 发表<br />
&lt;br /&gt;<br />
因为GE根本没把户外面料市场当一回事<br />
<br />
就冲这点,我就不选event了:你都不把我们当回事,凭什么要我们把你当回事
<br />戈尔公司的盈利重点也不在户外产品,你不会不选它吧?
发表于 2009-10-17 13:41 | 显示全部楼层
原帖由 <i>zhujie1225</i> 于 2009-10-17 13:18 发表<br />
&lt;br /&gt;戈尔公司的盈利重点也不在户外产品,你不会不选它吧?
<br />
gore的产品能修补
发表于 2009-10-17 16:30 | 显示全部楼层
原帖由 <i>zhujie1225</i> 于 2009-10-17 10:06 发表<br />
实际使用中,至少周围几位感觉eVENT的透气效果很好。<br />
<br />
为什么eVENT的市场做得不好?因为GE根本没把户外面料市场当一回事,毕竟这市场太小。甚至连GE的员工有的也只知道GTX,而不知道eVENT。
<br />

eVENT不耐操,除了透气比GTX好一点外,其他性能指标都不如GTX。
发表于 2009-10-17 16:37 | 显示全部楼层
原帖由 <i>月饼</i> 于 2009-10-17 16:30 发表<br />
&lt;br /&gt;<br />
<br />
eVENT不耐操,除了透气比GTX好一点外,其他性能指标都不如GTX。
<br />

这个理论还是第一次听见,请上数据证明
发表于 2009-10-17 16:52 | 显示全部楼层
耐不耐操是表布决定的,和四氟薄膜没太大关系,你说生料带有多结实?
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